ENB #98 The Clean Energy Crisis by Donn Dears, The challenge of replacing fossil fuels. We talked about a key solution in the EV space.

Clean Energy Crisis - Donn Dears
Source: ENB

Clean Energy Crisis: The Challenge of Replacing Fossil Fuels

by Mr Donn Dougherty Dears

Clean Energy Crisis: The Challenge of Replacing Fossil Fuels

With the Energy Crisis worsening by the day, Donn’s book is even more relevant today than ever. Between geopolitical, printing money for 20 years for renewable energy growth, and lack of investments in fossil fuels has set the stage for a global economic crisis.

While preparing for this interview with Donn, I went through the book and was duly impressed with the statistics, numbers, and facts. This book is a must-read before any family reunion to talk with family members with facts rather than emotions.

While Donn and I both believe that the energy transition is necessary, technology is not there to support the transition without devastating results. We discussed the solution of hybrid cars, and I don’t understand why these are not more widely accepted. They seem to be the perfect bridge to lower the number of batteries and give more range to the EV.

I highly recommend buying his books and keep on your desk. The reference material is fantastic.

Thank you, Donn, for stopping by the podcast. Thank you for your service to our country in the military and your research in the energy market. – Stu

A compete article covering the story will be released soon.


Graphic Below: These are some critical stats taken from Don’s book. – It is physically impossible to achieve net-zero carbon by 2050.

Source: Donn Dears and ENB

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Video Transcription edited for grammar. We disavow any errors unless they make us look better or smarter.

Stuart Turley: [00:00:03] Good morning, everybody. Today is not just a great day. It’s a fabulous day. My name’s Duke Turley and president CEO of the Sandstone Group. And I’m here with a very, very special guest. We’ve got Dan Diers. [00:00:17][13.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:00:17] He’s got lots of books out there, and we’ve got two of them here to talk about. But let me tell you a little bit about Don. [00:00:24][6.3]

Stuart Turley: [00:00:24] Don is a Korean that he is an author. He’s a man about town. And I guarantee you we’re going to have a fun discussion. Don, thank you so much for stopping by. [00:00:38][13.4]

Donn Dears: [00:00:39] Well, it’s great. I’m glad to be with you. [00:00:40][1.5]

Stuart Turley: [00:00:41] Oh, I’ll tell you. As you can tell, I get a little excited talking about things and everything else and we were just chit chatting right before here. [00:00:48][7.3]

Stuart Turley: [00:00:49] Thank you for your service to our country. And tell us a little bit. You were in Korea. You were in the Navy and on a couple ships. Tell us just a little bit about your background on in the military. [00:01:04][14.3]

Donn Dears: [00:01:05] Well, I was on active duty during the Korean War on a couple of different ships that were service ships. I mean, we were one was an oiler and the other was a refrigerated cargo ship. [00:01:15][10.3]

Donn Dears: [00:01:16] So what we what we did was we provided food to the other Navy ships during the under way replenishment. [00:01:25][9.2]

Donn Dears: [00:01:28] And I was chief engineering officer and one of them in damage control officer and the other. [00:01:31][3.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:01:32] Oh, damage control guys. Or they or they got to not make a mistake. [00:01:39][6.3]

Donn Dears: [00:01:40] Well, that was an interesting I mean, I when I first got call up to active duty. I went to work 4 to 6 week damage control school at that time was in Philadelphia and it was a great experience I learned a great deal. [00:01:56][16.1]

Donn Dears: [00:01:57] Atomic, biological and chemical warfare, among other things, which were very, very at that time, you know, a long time ago. But at that time, it was very front and center. [00:02:09][12.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:02:10] Wow. Well, so how did you get from damage control to damage control in energy? Because your books I just want to give a shout out the looming energy crisis. Are blackouts inevitable? You have other books as well. [00:02:28][18.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:02:29] And then this one that I really went through is Clean Energy Crisis, The Challenge of Replacing Fossil fuels. And Don, before we get into this, you did an outstanding job going through the numbers so damage control by the numbers should be the tagline under here [00:02:48][19.6]

Donn Dears: [00:02:50] And that’s interesting. Okay. [00:02:51][1.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:02:53] But how what got you started in your industry energy expert. [00:02:57][4.6]

Donn Dears: [00:02:59] Well, after I left the Navy, I went to work for General Electric on their manufacturing management program, which was essentially an internal MBA program and I spent three years on that. [00:03:12][12.9]

Donn Dears: [00:03:13] But basically, I spent my entire career, General Electric, working in different and, you know, different products industries, locomotives, steam turbines, Transformers, DC Motors, each of the small jet engines and I spent some time in each of those businesses, which was a great experience. [00:03:34][20.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:03:35] Right. [00:03:35][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:03:35] And then, of course. Later on during the career, I, I set up established companies. Overseas in how many countries? Several countries to establish companies that would service G.E. gas turbines and other products. [00:03:56][21.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:03:57] Hmm. [00:03:57][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:03:58] So, you know, set them up everywhere from Bahrain to Singapore. Let’s put it out. [00:04:03][5.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:04:04] Wow. And so when did you get the writing bug? [00:04:08][3.5]

Donn Dears: [00:04:09] After I as an engineer, one doesn’t expect engineers to be writers but the after I after I retired, I started to get interested in very, very early into this Kyoto. Fiasco that we went through around 2000. [00:04:32][22.9]

Donn Dears: [00:04:33] And that just got me very interested in that subject. And then that led me to start writing articles. And I had a blog. I still have a blog, and I went from articles to books. [00:04:48][14.9]

Stuart Turley: [00:04:50] Fantastic. Well, as you know, I’m a wannabe. I’m working on some things right now so I think that’s one of the reasons that I really enjoyed this. [00:05:01][11.3]

Stuart Turley: [00:05:02] Because when we’re out there and we’re talking, there’s people that flap and then there’s people that talk facts and so I’m always needing to fact check myself. So anybody that gets your book needs to keep it on their desk because facts don’t lie and in so dedicated to my great, great grandchildren and all the other children in America, I’m sorry, as pretty darn cool. [00:05:31][28.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:05:32] So there’s a couple things in here that first grab as we go through here. Sorry. Sorry. I just really enjoyed the book. You can tell your big government with this bureaucracy as well as big business, are on board with the climate and CO2 clean energy crisis. That kind of sets the whole stage for where everything is going right now. [00:05:59][26.4]

Donn Dears: [00:05:59] And yeah, it really does. I mean, it appears as though most businesses are supporting this idea of CO2 or supporting the idea that fossil fuels must be eliminated. [00:06:13][13.4]

Donn Dears: [00:06:14] And obviously that’s the government position at this point in time and yet when you start to dig into the facts surrounding the use of fossil fuels and the alternatives, you suddenly realize that you can’t eliminate fossil fuels. There are two important and two pervasive, and they’re to efficient and low cost. [00:06:38][24.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:06:40] Right. You know, I’m of the opinion we need to get low cost energy to everyone in the world and let the markets decide while having the least amount of impact on the environment. Okay. [00:06:52][12.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:06:53] That there are some places that renewables do make sense. Nuclear, love, Nuclear Hawaii. I mean, you can’t ship things to Hawaii very easily. Okay. Solar, wind might make sense there,. [00:07:06][13.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:07:06] But you got to have the numbers and the market per kilowatt hour come down a lot. You got some facts in here also. But you first start off in fossil fuels and geopolitical. [00:07:17][10.9]

Stuart Turley: [00:07:19] Geopolitical is such a big animal in this game. You talk about China wanting to displace the U.S. That makes a big difference as well, too. [00:07:29][9.8]

Donn Dears: [00:07:30] Oh, yeah. There’s no question. I mean, China has evolved into our major competitor, both both in the point of view of industry, but also from the point of view of strategy. [00:07:41][11.8]

Donn Dears: [00:07:43] And they, at this point in time are on a path that is to displace the United States as the leading economy in the world, and that that’s their plan. In fact, Pillsbury work goes through. They have a 50 year plan to replace the United States. [00:08:09][27.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:08:12] I’ll tell you, I love your quote in here. The lower cost of energy, the greater its effect on economic growth and prosperity. [00:08:19][7.4]

Donn Dears: [00:08:21] Than actually that I think I’ve coined that. But I think that’s the absolute truth. [00:08:26][5.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:08:27] Absolutely. Yeah. [00:08:28][1.0]

Donn Dears: [00:08:29] And we’re blessed in the United States for having just a huge reserves of fossil fuels that that allow us to have cheap energy. [00:08:41][12.0]

Donn Dears: [00:08:41] And that cheap energy is is so important, too, because it allows us to have a very viable, efficient economy. [00:08:51][9.5]

Stuart Turley: [00:08:52] Right. And you also address in here the fact that we were always energy dependent by importing. [00:09:00][7.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:09:01] And then 2020 we became energy independent by exporting a lot of coal, exporting everything else. And so that that is a huge transitional point in 2020. [00:09:13][12.2]

Donn Dears: [00:09:15] Yeah, that’s exactly right. And I think one of the first early chapters I go through each of the fossil fuels oil, natural gas and coal. [00:09:25][10.8]

Donn Dears: [00:09:26] And we have in this country, in our in our country, we have the largest reserves of all of those. No other country in the world has the reserves of fossil fuels that we have, which is a huge strategic and economic advantage. [00:09:41][15.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:09:43] It’s nuts. You actually I love this. The U.S. has 264 billion barrels, Russia, 256 billion barrels, Saudi Arabia 212 billion in reserve. I mean, we’re over Russia and people don’t realize that. [00:10:04][20.9]

Donn Dears: [00:10:05] I mean, we have people forget that we not only have what the Gulf of Mexico and the Permian Basin and all that, we’ve got Alaska, which has a huge amount of untapped reserves. So we’re very fortunate. [00:10:20][15.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:10:21] And coal coal’s got 249 billion tons of proven coal return. And boy, the EU is buying all they can get. [00:10:32][11.7]

Donn Dears: [00:10:34] Yeah. Again, we’re very fortunate in that. [00:10:36][2.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:10:37] And. [00:10:37][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:10:38] You know, actually coal is very important, not as much for us today because we have natural gas, which is such a efficient way to generate electricity. [00:10:49][11.5]

Donn Dears: [00:10:51] But countries around the world don’t. It may not have natural gas. In fact, most of them don’t this is why they’re importing LNG. [00:10:58][7.6]

Donn Dears: [00:11:00] But they do have coal, Indonesia and India and some and that coal is is could provide a lot of people a lot of cheap energy. [00:11:10][10.3]

Stuart Turley: [00:11:11] One one of the things that I really liked and I’m sorry if I keep getting excited, but you’ll have to slow me down occasionally but you also had in here the clean coal tech and I can’t remember what chapter it was. [00:11:23][11.5]

Donn Dears: [00:11:23] Right. [00:11:23][0.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:11:24] Putting in coal our coal with the I believe it was the new metals that you had that it allowed it to go have allowed less pollution by using the new technology. Is that a fair statement? [00:11:38][14.0]

Donn Dears: [00:11:39] Actually, metallurgy has come to the point that the that the coal fired power plants can operate at much higher temperatures and pressures, and that has allowed them to become much more efficient. [00:11:53][13.9]

Donn Dears: [00:11:54] Now, most of the coal fired power plants we have in the United States, all except one were supercritical pole coal plants and they operated about 33% efficient. [00:12:04][10.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:12:05] Right. [00:12:05][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:12:06] But but the new, highly efficient, low emission, ultra supercritical coal fired power plants operate at 45% efficiency, which is a huge improvement. [00:12:17][10.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:12:18] And why don’t we also export that technology around the world? Because that to me seems let’s get it to Africa at a reduced rate. [00:12:27][9.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:12:28] Let’s teach people how to have less impact on the environment, but still use a lower cost fuel. I mean, wouldn’t that make sense? [00:12:36][8.2]

Donn Dears: [00:12:37] Oh, it makes a lot of sense. And and I think countries like Indonesia and India and in Africa can use the hill of high efficiency, low emission coal fired power plants to generate cheap electricity. And it’s probably the best way for them to proceed from this point forward. [00:13:00][22.6]

Donn Dears: [00:13:01] But they’re being deterred from doing it by this effort, international effort, I might add, to eliminate fossil fuels. [00:13:10][8.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:13:11] You know, and and Alex Epstein, I’ve had the pleasure of interviewing him twice. [00:13:16][4.5]

Donn Dears: [00:13:17] He’s written a couple of very good books in nickel. [00:13:19][2.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:13:21] I love his aspect on it and the humanitarian aspect and you take a look of crossing your quote, which is way cool, and saying that it elevates up at a prosperity because of the low cost. It would make sense for us to take a look at nuclear. [00:13:41][19.9]

Stuart Turley: [00:13:41] Your numbers in here. I’m sorry, those numbers are fabulous. When you start looking at the kilowatt per hour chart, let me see if I can find that here real quick. You have. Oh, shoot. Where is the cost per kilowatt hour? Oh, well, I’ll find that. We’ll talk about that later. [00:14:00][18.5]

Stuart Turley: [00:14:00] You lay out the difference of cost per kilowatt hour where it was years ago and where it is now after renewables and I believe there’s such like a 40% increase in kilowatt. It was $0.07 nights, whatever that number was and it’s now up to, you know, even more by gigantic standards. [00:14:20][20.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:14:21] Because of the addition of the requirements for renewables and nobody’s calculating that in because those are some important numbers. Let me go ahead. [00:14:32][11.0]

Donn Dears: [00:14:33] Yeah, no, I know the chart. You’re referring to it. That was in my book, The Looming Energy Crisis. And then in this book to. [00:14:39][6.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:14:40] Right. [00:14:40][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:14:42] The little bit of history is required here. Back around 2000, FERC, the Federal Energy Commission, proposed that the. That they let the grid be managed differently than it had been in the past. [00:15:02][20.2]

Donn Dears: [00:15:03] In the past, the grid had been managed by each individual utility. Overseen by regulators, state regulators. But they proposed FERC proposed that they set up regional transmission organizations and independent system operators who would then control and manage the grid within their areas. [00:15:29][25.3]

Donn Dears: [00:15:30] And about two thirds of the country is now managed by our geos and ISOs. [00:15:35][4.9]

Stuart Turley: [00:15:36] Right. [00:15:36][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:15:36] And. One third is still managed the old fashioned way with utilities and regulators. And that chart you refer to shows that those areas and have adopted autos and ISOs. [00:15:53][16.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:15:54] Right. [00:15:54][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:15:55] Their electricity is now much more expensive than. The electricity being produced in the areas managed the old fashioned way. And the reason for that is that the are and ISOs. Established procedures whereby they are forcing wind and solar onto the grid. [00:16:19][24.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:16:20] Right. [00:16:20][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:16:20] And wind and solar, especially when you add in backup and battery support, it is much more expensive than generating electricity with natural gas, coal or nuclear. [00:16:34][13.5]

Stuart Turley: [00:16:35] There’s a couple of formulas that I want to bring up in here that were critical that nobody is really talking about. And I love those. Excuse me. [00:16:43][8.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:16:44] Your average increase in this chart from 2003 to 2019, sorry, that chart average increase was 64% on what you just described. [00:16:58][13.5]

Donn Dears: [00:16:59] Yeah,. [00:16:59][0.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:16:59] That’s nuts. I mean, good grief. Now, the reason, if I understood this correctly, was because of the additional power required. That was in a different chart that you had a regular standard of extra required power for the grid for coal and natural gas, I believe was 10%. I’m just going to throw that number out there somewhere for the extra powe. [00:17:30][30.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:17:31] And then when you added in renewables, the extra power that you needed in order to sustain the grid was astronomically higher. [00:17:40][9.2]

Donn Dears: [00:17:42] I mean, we’re actually I think you’re referring to the reserve margins. [00:17:47][5.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:17:48] Yes. Thank you. Yeah. [00:17:49][1.0]

Donn Dears: [00:17:49] Yeah. I mean, historically, the. Nurk Another group that’s that engineering group that supports work had had. Had pointed out that in they they I forget the exact number, but they say that you needed to have between ten and 15% reserve capacity. [00:18:13][24.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:18:15] Right. [00:18:15][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:18:15] In order to ensure that you only had one incident every ten years, an incident being black out or a brownout. So every utility used to have between ten and 15% reserve capacity. [00:18:33][18.1]

Donn Dears: [00:18:35] That reserve capacity was over at above the peak that they had ever had before. So that if they had a problem with weather or equipment, they would always have enough backup capacity to generate the electricity needed to keep the grid from having blackouts. [00:18:54][19.4]

Donn Dears: [00:18:55] Now, that’s that’s been turned upside down with the addition of wind and solar. [00:19:02][6.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:19:03] Right. [00:19:03][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:19:03] Because wind and solar are unreliable. No matter how you try to manipulate them. [00:19:12][8.3]

Stuart Turley: [00:19:12] Right. [00:19:12][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:19:12] They are. They just may not be there when you need it. And the wind may not blow and the sun may not shine. And if they’re not there when you need them, then you have blackouts. Right. And that’s what happened in Texas a couple of years ago. [00:19:27][14.9]

Stuart Turley: [00:19:29] That was not too good. [00:19:30][0.6]

Donn Dears: [00:19:31] A couple hundred people died because of that. [00:19:34][2.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:19:34] Yes. And people were getting thousand dollar electric bills overnight. It was kind of like, oh, my goodness. [00:19:39][5.1]

Stuart Turley: [00:19:40] Now, when you take a look at I interviewed shortening the grin with Meredith Angwin and she she is way cool, too. She is a big nuclear fan and the numbers that you also talked about in here were once you get to that 10 to 15%, you have to add so much more renewable in some of the old calculations that I was looking at, which were great in here, were so people are thinking they’re a windmill or a wind tower can generate, let’s just say one one gigawatt or whatever the farm is going to do. [00:20:21][40.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:20:22] But then you need to do let’s say you have one windmill, it generates x number of kilowatts per hour. In order to do that one, you have to add in another hundred in order to get the grid balanced. Whatever those numbers match out,. [00:20:37][15.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:20:38] People are not adding that cost in when they’re calculating the cost of a wind farm. Does that make sense? [00:20:45][7.0]

Donn Dears: [00:20:46] No, you’re entirely right. I mean, okay, wind turbines, their capacity factors are down in the 30%, which means that they’re only generating electricity maybe 30% of the time. So they’re where their nameplate rating may be one megawatt. [00:21:05][19.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:21:06] Right. [00:21:06][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:21:07] But there that’s that’s overstating how much electricity they’re actually generating. Right. Because they’re only generating about a third of that. Right. [00:21:17][10.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:21:18] So you need in order to get the same, let’s say, ten megawatts, you’re going to need 30 of the wind farm windmills. [00:21:28][10.2]

Donn Dears: [00:21:30] You know, three times as much, I mean, as compared to a natural gas power plant. Yeah,. [00:21:34][5.0]

Donn Dears: [00:21:35] Because natural gas power plants, they’re they I mean, if they are allowed to operate without having to follow the load. [00:21:42][6.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:21:43] Right. [00:21:43][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:21:44] Right. Up around 85% capacity factor. [00:21:46][2.5]

Stuart Turley: [00:21:47] Your numbers. See, I over here, I went to Oklahoma State University, so I have to use a crayon on my crayon math. And. And I did graduate. Not very not very high score tho, though. [00:21:59][12.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:22:00] But when you sit back and take a look. I love this line. It was on page 58. The total number of new wind turbines needed to produce 2.5 megawatts to achieve net zero carbon by 2050 is 995,000 new windmills and then the average to be installed units must be install we got to install 35,000 a year to hit that number. [00:22:35][34.3]

Donn Dears: [00:22:36] Yeah. [00:22:36][0.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:22:38] We can’t do that. [00:22:38][0.7]

Donn Dears: [00:22:39] No, I mean that that’s where net zero is absolutely ridiculous. I mean, I went through and it’s in the in that chapter there, I went through wind, solar and nuclear and also combined them. [00:22:55][16.3]

Donn Dears: [00:22:57] And it’s impossible to achieve net zero. It just is not feasible. No, you could try to do it by 2050, which is the goal. [00:23:05][8.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:23:07] And so your numbers are going to sit right here because I think that this is right. And then when I was lucky enough to interview Gregory, Right. Stan Twice. And he also did a nice intro to your book. [00:23:20][12.8]

Donn Dears: [00:23:21] Yeah,. [00:23:21][0.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:23:21] I love his thoughts that CO2 is not always that bad. Trees like it so there is the argument which one yours is dealing in numbers, in dealing and financing, because it’s my unprofessional opinion. If you print money in order to pay for something that is not technologically okay, means inflation’s going to hit. [00:23:48][26.8]

Donn Dears: [00:23:49] Yeah, of course. [00:23:49][0.4]

Stuart Turley: [00:23:50] Yeah. You don’t seem to understand. [00:23:52][2.0]

Donn Dears: [00:23:53] That’s right. [00:23:53][0.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:23:54] Print money, inflation, or people get poorer that’s my OS you crave en masse. [00:24:03][8.2]

Donn Dears: [00:24:06] No matter how you do with crayons or pens, it comes out the same. [00:24:09][3.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:24:10] It does? Yeah. No, I love I love Evie’s. I love the fact that electronic vehicles are great. Okay, super but the technology’s not there yet as well. [00:24:22][12.5]

Stuart Turley: [00:24:23] Now, if you give me a hybrid, I think that that’s a great way to use the best of both worlds. You get a hybrid and you get 50 miles per gallon that’s starting to make a little sense to me you know, 75 miles per gallon. Well, wait a minute. Because you use half the battery, you use half that. Okay. That technology is here. It’s making sense. [00:24:47][23.6]

[00:24:48] But your numbers on the Eevee kind of like make it frightening, because if the EV lasts, the batteries need to be changed after eight years and after 8 years, let’s say you sell it at ten years and the battery still works, but that person is going to have to put in a $10,000 battery upgrade. All of a sudden you’ve got a worthless car. [00:25:13][24.8]

Donn Dears: [00:25:14] Yeah, actually, that’s an interesting I went through the arithmetic there about the difference between internal combustion engines and battery powered vehicles. [00:25:25][10.5]

Stuart Turley: [00:25:25] Right. [00:25:25][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:25:26] Yeah. And you know, the internal combustion engine, the drive, train engine and transmission, they last the full 12 years, whatever it is. 12 years of the life of the vehicle. [00:25:39][12.7]

Stuart Turley: [00:25:40] Right. [00:25:40][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:25:40] That doesn’t. That’s not true with the battery. Battery has to be replaced. So that adds to the cost. [00:25:45][5.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:25:47] I drive my car. I don’t trade cars very often. I have 250 300,000 on mine. I get kind of used to a car. I don’t trade at all very often, you know, if I just get it molded and just right, that’s okay with me. [00:26:03][15.9]

Donn Dears: [00:26:04] I’m with you, actually. I do keep my cars a long time. [00:26:08][3.8]

Donn Dears: [00:26:11] But you mentioned the hybrids. I wrote in an article I used one of my neighbors who has a hybrid car as an example, because down here where we live, you really don’t have to travel very far to do what you’re doing. [00:26:25][14.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:26:26] Right. [00:26:26][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:26:26] And she. Her hybrid can go like 48 miles I think it was on on battery report kicks over to the gasoline and yet most of her trips every day are like less than 30 miles. [00:26:43][16.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:26:44] Right. [00:26:44][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:26:44] So she’s actually she’s actually traveling using virtually no gasoline and just battery powered because the only travels 30 to 40 miles every day and so the hybrid just makes a lot of sense when you think about it in those terms. [00:27:00][16.3]

Stuart Turley: [00:27:01] Oh, absolutely. In fact, if I was going to do something and I would get a hybrid and a regular gasoline car because I travel between my houses, let alone drive, you know,. [00:27:17][15.8]

Stuart Turley: [00:27:19] I do a lot more than than that because I go back and forth between Oklahoma and Texas. And now a hybrid would make it. [00:27:27][8.2]

Donn Dears: [00:27:28] Yeah, but but so anyway, there Toyota is another one that is really still pushing that concept. I think it’s a good concept. [00:27:39][11.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:27:40] Oh, I do, too. And I love your math on that. I’ll tell you what, Don, as you as you go through this, I’m highly recommending all of your books. I recommend everybody follow you on your blog. How can people find your book or how can people find you? [00:28:02][21.7]

Donn Dears: [00:28:03] Well, first of all, the book is available on Amazon. It’s easy to get all my all my books are available on Amazon, at least the ones that are still in print. The Looming Energy crisis. [00:28:15][11.8]

Donn Dears: [00:28:16] Actually that book is if anybody wants to understand how the grid operates and how the grid is being managed. [00:28:23][7.0]

Stuart Turley: [00:28:24] Right. [00:28:24][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:28:24] That’s the book that explains it. And in fact, I actually refer to it a couple of times in my new book, A clean, you know, Clean Energy Crisis, because it’s it’s part of the equation as to why we have a problem in trying to get replace fossil fuels with renewables. [00:28:43][18.7]

Donn Dears: [00:28:44] Mm hmm. [00:28:44][0.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:28:45] Right. And again, thank you so much. So Amazon and your blog and. [00:28:51][6.1]

Donn Dears: [00:28:52] Yeah. Just go to Power for USA is the name of the blog. [00:28:58][5.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:28:59] Okay. [00:28:59][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:28:59] I think you can get to it, but the ideas or whatever. But either power for USA or ideas. [00:29:05][5.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:29:06] I’ll tell you what, we’re going to have all that in the show notes and we will publish this out. We’ll get it out to all of the channels and everything else. And so we really thank you for stopping by. [00:29:17][10.8]

Donn Dears: [00:29:17] Well, great advice, but this is a great interview and I appreciate the opportunity to talk about some of these topics, which I find extremely important. [00:29:27][9.9]

Donn Dears: [00:29:28] They’re extremely important because if we follow this idea of trying to get rid of fossil fuels,. [00:29:36][7.6]

Stuart Turley: [00:29:37] Right,. [00:29:37][0.0]

Donn Dears: [00:29:37] It could actually destroy our country. [00:29:38][1.2]

Stuart Turley: [00:29:40] World. I’ll take it one step further. And by the way, thank you. [00:29:40][0.0]